Tommy Mitchell: Artist's Journey from Sports to Canvas & Creative Evolution

00;00;10;14 - 00;00;35;19
Rob Lee
Welcome to the truth in this art. Your source. The conversations at the crossroads of arts, culture and community. I am your host, Rob, early today. I'm excited to welcome my next guest. A Biloxi, Mississippi, born in Baltimore, based self-taught artist, elevating portraiture, using ballpoint pens, drawing inspiration from a myriad of life experiences. Please welcome Tommy Mitchell. Welcome to the podcast.

00;00;36;13 - 00;00;37;27
Tommy Mitchell
Thank you for having me. I appreciate it.

00;00;38;13 - 00;00;44;16
Rob Lee
Thank you for pulling up, making the time. Literally, you know, you noticed the pull of that, right? You know? You know, that has definitely.

00;00;44;16 - 00;00;57;28
Tommy Mitchell
Come on. It was actually pull 2020. Come on. I'm ready right now. I'm ready right now. I got my on the floor like I hope it has a gym clothes. There's a LA Fitness across the street.

00;00;58;29 - 00;01;26;24
Rob Lee
I'm just doing protein shakes and banging weights and I'm not even hitting the. But, you know, again, thank you for making the time is truly an honor to have yours and you know, thank you to kick things off. I did the the online, you know, copying pace, you know, artist by artist statement sort of thing. But I like to give, you know, folks that join me for this podcast as the opportunity to describe themselves like their their bio, how they present themselves.

00;01;27;20 - 00;01;44;01
Rob Lee
You know, they're are folks who and I've gotten this before where I'll do an intro, get all of the put myself in character. And then like you forgot a detail. But I was like, What's the detail? I'm a human first. I'm like, I'm on your Yeah, y'all got to introduce yourself. So if you will give us your bio.

00;01;44;18 - 00;02;13;02
Tommy Mitchell
Of like every artist talk, I always start with athlete, artist, creative, visionary vessel. I'm constantly evolving, whether that be through my work, my experiences, what I'm learning just always seeking information and how I could implement it and share it and just, you know, grow. So course an evolution.

00;02;14;05 - 00;02;39;23
Rob Lee
Evolution is is key. It's, I think is tied to ambition. Right. Like have these conversations with folks. And I mean, as I was saying earlier before we got started, where I'm at in the sort of cycle of interviews that splurge, as I call it, riding the wave and, you know, being kind of your toughest critic. But also like I'm good at this, so, you know, kind of doing that waxing and waning through that.

00;02;40;15 - 00;02;49;17
Rob Lee
So as far as as far and thank you for sharing that. By the way, you're an athlete piece wasn't in that didn't have it in it. I didn't think about it. You know, you got the thing going on.

00;02;49;21 - 00;02;52;00
Tommy Mitchell
Oh, yeah.

00;02;52;21 - 00;03;02;19
Rob Lee
So talk a bit about your your journey creatively and always feel weird. Like the word journey feels this weird to me. You know.

00;03;03;05 - 00;03;29;03
Tommy Mitchell
I, I use that religiously. On the flight over here, a young lady was watching me draw, and I told her, like, this is all part of my journey. Like, I my path, my journey, my, my exploration. But I use journey the most because that's something that anyone can reference. I try to think. I try to break it down.

00;03;29;03 - 00;03;56;11
Tommy Mitchell
I come from a retail background, so I always look at my journey at three phases the phase, the early phases, where I'm in admiration, admiring the comics, the TV shows, magazine covers, song and so forth. And then the next phase is actually implementation. Now I'm working and drawing and saying, okay, this is fine, but what else can be done?

00;03;57;04 - 00;04;25;24
Tommy Mitchell
And then for me, the last phase is actually participating. The participation aspect where I'm in the field, I'm in the trenches now, okay? I'm taking everything from the aspirational phase, the the work phase where I'm implementing what I'm learning. And now I'm in the mix. I'm trying to figure out, okay, one, I'm a creative. Two, what's the business look like?

00;04;26;00 - 00;04;48;29
Tommy Mitchell
Like they tell you as a kid, starving artist, starving artists. So on and so forth. And it's like, Well, how can I combat that? And for me, I thought, well, if I work retail or, you know, have these jobs where I can gain these business experiences of this this business acumen, I can take that with me and get paid for it while I'm, you know, working my way up the ladder.

00;04;49;20 - 00;05;20;11
Tommy Mitchell
Marketing, teamwork, discipline, so on and so forth. But yeah, that's that's been pretty much my journey is just implementing what I'm seeing and learning and exploring that and seeing where else can I take it? Yeah. So yeah, it's just I always try to break it down to those three different phases. And after that, you know, who knows what's next, you know, it could be recycling and starting from scratch with a whole different passion.

00;05;20;15 - 00;05;20;28
Tommy Mitchell
So.

00;05;22;04 - 00;05;49;14
Rob Lee
So. And thank you. So, so, so for you. Where where does it begin? Like, I think we have those those points that we'll say that's the that's the beginning. But also there's a real beginning or that the real one. This is more of the real one. Yeah. I shared it before it actually. It happened on this podcast where, you know, I was interviewing an artist and you know, I was telling was like I was an emcee, you know, I wasn't on a microphone rapping.

00;05;49;14 - 00;06;11;07
Rob Lee
I was an emcee. You know, this is the ceremony for this, you know, graduation as a kid, like four or five. And like, that's probably something that has had some impact on you as you've grown up. Right. And I never thought about it that way. But, you know, in in dialog with someone who's also creative, it has that sort of mindset is like, no, no, you should explore that a little bit.

00;06;11;22 - 00;06;24;08
Rob Lee
So for you, what was one of those like early moments like in your in your life that you're like, all right, I like I like drawing or, oh, I like art or Oh, wow, this is something that's interesting to me.

00;06;25;04 - 00;06;50;10
Tommy Mitchell
Yeah, I always think, like, I there's this, like, Malcolm Gladwell book that I think of often outliers. And I think at certain points in my life, I'm like, okay, well, in the early stages, the point was we're in we're in Hampton, Virginia. I'm on the floor drawing. My dad's on the couch. I'm drawing something. And I just remember him saying, to draw what you see.

00;06;51;05 - 00;07;12;27
Tommy Mitchell
And for me, I'm like, Oh, well, you know, I guess I can't be an abstract artist now, but that stuck with me. It's like, okay, if I want to do something and it's going to be an image and you know, it's a mirror image of that, I want to make sure that the details of their the loan work is like it's all encompassing.

00;07;13;04 - 00;07;39;08
Tommy Mitchell
So that was like the first thing that I can think of. But the question I've been asking more recently is, do people who try to think how to word it? Do people enjoy like cartoons or animation, etc.? Do they stick with it and follow that path in the arts, whatever it may be? Yeah. So I just think of stuff like that.

00;07;39;08 - 00;08;04;24
Tommy Mitchell
But for me, just sitting there drawing and my dad giving me that feedback in real time at an early age draw, which you see, it's like, okay, if I'm going to keep doing this, I want to make sure that I'm executing everything to the utmost, to the highest level, to the nth degree. Yeah. And that, that to me I think was the starting point for okay, everyone's a creative, everyone's an artist.

00;08;04;24 - 00;08;20;06
Tommy Mitchell
But, you know, some of us just stick with it. Some of us like, you know what, I want to make this a career, you know, what do I need to do to make it a career? And I've always said I'll do whatever it takes to go down this path. And thankfully. Right.

00;08;21;02 - 00;08;38;11
Rob Lee
That's just great. And, you know, conversations I've had, I had one earlier and I think I think it ties like the, you know, one point and I had it in the questions as a sense your way about you know I used to illustrator used to draw and now I'm a book artist and you know, as capitalist as like yeah.

00;08;38;11 - 00;08;56;20
Rob Lee
And we've got so many sketches for your between these tests and you know, I end up going to this, you know, doing the entry test to do this art school and just, you know, confidence, skill. I didn't have sort of the, you know, artistic family. I didn't come from that. It was like I have an uncle. I had an uncle.

00;08;56;20 - 00;09;15;00
Rob Lee
I never met him. He passed before I was born. And I was the artist. So like, you know, I have relatives who weren't really familiar with it from what he did. And they were trying their best to say, Hey, here's some R books, here's, you know, here's some some things you're interested in. How can we help foster support that?

00;09;15;11 - 00;09;34;19
Rob Lee
But when it came to that side of it, that's the reason I'm doing podcasting now. Or I, I did writing for a bit, but, you know, using I'll Throw a book your way using the sort of Austin Kleon of it all, you know, it's just like, I don't want to cut off those limbs. I came back eventually, but in a different way.

00;09;34;28 - 00;09;54;08
Rob Lee
I was like, I have a sense of humor. I know it was funny. I get references. Let's have somebody else illustrate it and let me write it and let me collaborate, partner, and let me make myself a part of that scene and dove in it. And that's kind of the the thing that was here in there a moment ago of like whatever is sort of the creative practice is dove in it.

00;09;55;04 - 00;10;23;01
Tommy Mitchell
Right? Right. That's I always think of it like this. I started drawing and I got to a point. I'm like, okay, I can draw to the cows, come home. What else can I do? And I dabble with watercolor permanent markers. I just wanted to make the best work possible. And then it became, well, I'll use whatever medium to achieve that, and I'm on my way third or fourth by my fifth year painting.

00;10;23;01 - 00;10;43;02
Tommy Mitchell
Now I'm fully immersed in and it's something that I used to be. So I guess it's all crazy about painting, actually, and I get shit for this, but I thought, Hey, anyone can paint drawing. It's art like you got to you got to be able to like you got to make it look like this person. If not, then but then I started painting on.

00;10;43;03 - 00;11;10;02
Tommy Mitchell
I know this is too so yeah. I mean, and I'll also say this I've been trying to remove hard from my vocabulary. I, I don't want to say things are hard. It's either a lack of information or a lack of knowledge. And, you know, that's where I'm at with it. I want to make sure I accumulate or, you know, find that information and gain that knowledge.

00;11;10;02 - 00;11;29;23
Tommy Mitchell
And then I can no longer be like, Oh, that's hard. It's like, no, I put the repetition in and it's not hard anymore. It's, it's doable or it's easy or whatever. So yeah, that's something I always try to implement is how can I turn these negative into a positive or strengthen progress.

00;11;30;12 - 00;11;32;15
Rob Lee
It's one of those there's 10,000 shots right.

00;11;33;25 - 00;11;37;04
Tommy Mitchell
Away, every day, all day. Got to get them shots up.

00;11;37;12 - 00;11;37;29
Rob Lee
And it's.

00;11;37;29 - 00;11;38;26
Tommy Mitchell
Got to get the shots up.

00;11;38;29 - 00;12;03;29
Rob Lee
It's even in that vein. I know his his book is is recent books. I've been making the rounds the the Rick Rubin joint and it's just yes there's there's not a I can it's more of it maybe I hope I'm attributing to him but it's not I can it's just like I haven't done it yet. It is really the thing is and you know, I go through this and sometimes I if I'm being completely honest, I'll do these interviews and you know, you're on my Baltimore come out, right?

00;12;03;29 - 00;12;26;05
Rob Lee
They all do these interviews. And I'm not sure if I'm a fraud or if I'm a charlatan or something like that because it's like I don't have art background. I'm just interested in talking to people and helping provide a platform for them to share their stories authentically versus not. Tell me about your work. So being a black artist, it's like, no, right, you know?

00;12;26;05 - 00;12;46;18
Rob Lee
Sure, that should be part of the conversation but shouldn't be the sort of we got to get these buzzwords and we got to get this keyword search, you know? And the thing I think that's sort of the spot that I'm in. No one's coming to me to hear the or to no one's coming to an interview that I'm conducting to hear the snooty, rarefied art conversation.

00;12;47;08 - 00;12;47;19
Rob Lee
Right.

00;12;48;15 - 00;12;49;13
Tommy Mitchell
So yeah.

00;12;49;24 - 00;13;11;22
Rob Lee
Yeah. So I think once I got kind of past that and realized what I'm actually doing, but always returning to it, always being curious. And I think I think it's good though. You one of the things you mentioned of removing hard from from from the second if you will you know I had two in Toronto. He does he's just like.

00;13;11;29 - 00;13;12;23
Rob Lee
Yes, that's right.

00;13;13;26 - 00;13;16;24
Tommy Mitchell
Yes, that's right. You either are you're not very old.

00;13;16;24 - 00;13;44;29
Rob Lee
The thing he was telling me so and I saw I don't know if this is correct, but I saw that you come from a creative family. You know, you have photographers in your family. So speak a bit about being in that environment as you're developing, you know, the sort of the household environment, as you're developing, as a as a creative, as an artist, as someone who is exploring it, curious about art and being around folks who are artists.

00;13;44;29 - 00;13;59;15
Rob Lee
As I shared a moment ago, I didn't really have that around. So it wasn't sort of that competition. It's like, Oh yeah, yeah, go ahead and draw. I don't care. Whatever you're doing right, don't take this job for me. You know, with this landscaping job, that's my right.

00;14;01;26 - 00;14;35;29
Tommy Mitchell
So, yeah, my dad was a photographer. He paused that when I was born and my sister is a photographer as well. Now I will say I, I don't recall my sisters work until maybe I was gosh, maybe in high school, give or take, and she'll probably kill me for not knowing. But my mom, it's funny. So I always used to tell people no one in the family is creative.

00;14;35;29 - 00;14;59;17
Tommy Mitchell
Right. And that's a lie, because, like I said, my my dad and my sister are photographers. My mom told me way after the fact that she drew as well. But I'm going 20 some odd years telling people like, oh, yeah, no one in the family like is a painter or draws is just me. And then my mom was like, No, I used to do X, Y, Z, you know, this is before you were born.

00;14;59;17 - 00;15;25;19
Tommy Mitchell
I'm like, Man, I won't stop what they were doing when I was born. Like, I wish I could have thought more of that, but I'm thankful that they supported me in their own ways. I didn't it was it wasn't traditional support. And I say that because their support look like, hey, buying supplies, what I'm picking support was, hey, put me in this art school.

00;15;26;05 - 00;15;45;13
Tommy Mitchell
And that wasn't my path. And I think my parents knew me so well that I was going to go to art school. I'm a self-taught artist, like you mentioned, but I'm always seeking information. So for me, the school will be fine. As far as like basics and a ground level foundation. But I need it more. I'm always searching.

00;15;45;13 - 00;16;04;04
Tommy Mitchell
What else? What else? What else? Like I would have wanted them to just give me a bunch of books, let me figure it out. And I remember my mom put me in this art class when I was like seventh grade. It was like art class outside of school. So I'm going and my age I'm still drawing pieces, portraits, whatever.

00;16;05;13 - 00;16;26;27
Tommy Mitchell
And the first day the guy's like, All right, we're going to go outside and draw trees. I'm like, I don't want to draw trees. I want to draw people. Teach me how to draw people better. That's why I'm here. Like so needless to say, like that was the only outside art tutorial, not tutorial, but tutelage that I had.

00;16;27;12 - 00;17;02;19
Tommy Mitchell
And it wasn't very favorable in my journey, but it learned a lesson of, Hey, even though this isn't what you want to do, take something from it. And that's when I started to think there's always a lesson in everything. Maybe, you know, he's looking for something different in me, in asking me to draw a tree. But yeah, now that the family, I just I'm thankful that I learned later on that, you know, I had other creative in the house one night.

00;17;02;24 - 00;17;27;23
Tommy Mitchell
I was so selfish to think that it was just me. Like I'm just, you know, the one drawing and be bopping around. But they're there for their photography and their photographic. I helped me with symmetry, just the minor details that we would overlook that helped me a lot in my work. So can your dad. I'm thankful, you know.

00;17;28;00 - 00;17;50;07
Rob Lee
So that's dope as dope. It's yeah, I think, you know, I this is this is down on me now, you know, like as I'm thinking about it, I remember I used to go to my grandmother's house back in the day. Right. And it would always be that thing where you're trying to determine where I would try to determine when am I an adult?

00;17;50;07 - 00;18;17;15
Rob Lee
When can I actually have it right. My whole cohort. And again, as I think about it, I'm like, this is a version of that. And doing these these interviews have an interesting perspective, have something to say, don't waste people's time. And, you know, no, maybe it's just dawning on me, as you were describing sort of, you know, the bits and pieces that go into what you do that are coming from a second hand, from your from your, your fam.

00;18;18;01 - 00;18;36;02
Rob Lee
It's making me think of that, of like waiting for that opportunity. Don't blow it. Make sure you say that right. You know, I mean, listening to your gang be on scene so so it's it's is great especially that the black household when you got something, you know, I make sure I got.

00;18;36;02 - 00;18;42;23
Tommy Mitchell
To make sure I got to be concrete. I got to be concrete. I've got to be some. Hey, we can stamp this. Are you good money around here?

00;18;42;23 - 00;19;00;17
Rob Lee
And so one or 2%. So let's let's shift gears a little bit about, you know, her specifically. So a bit about some of the themes that you explore or have you curious interest that are captivated like talk talk a bit about that.

00;19;01;07 - 00;19;24;06
Tommy Mitchell
Are that is something that I feel like isn't asked enough if I'm being honest and I have so many ideas and I always want to share it because I'm always seeking like, like I said earlier, what else can be done is anyone can draw a portrait, anyone. What can you do with it? What story can you tell with it?

00;19;24;28 - 00;19;56;27
Tommy Mitchell
And I always think I'm like every I'll even go back even further, I rewind further. When I was younger, I said, I want to be able to have a show. Let's say show in L.A. So in New York, short periods, Tokyo, all these different places all at once. And I say that to say I wanted to be able to work as efficiently and as fast, to be able to give all of those spaces work.

00;19;56;27 - 00;20;26;27
Tommy Mitchell
And each work body of work be different because each body of work represents not only that city, but that experience more so than anything. So yeah, I always want to have a different experience every show and that's it's hard because you got to come up with the ideas, etc., but at the same time I feel comfortable and just letting my imagination roam and I think that's one of my strong suit is just I'm a very curious person.

00;20;26;27 - 00;20;55;05
Tommy Mitchell
I'm always looking for. Like I said, the lesson and something are, you know, an idea and something I might see a pattern. I'm like, okay, where does this pattern come from? It just becomes a rabbit hole. And that's something I appreciate about my life is just, hey, I'm always seeking something. Just I'm such a visual person. Like, I just my Pinterest is crazy cause I'm like, okay, there's this over here, this.

00;20;55;25 - 00;21;16;18
Tommy Mitchell
And I my mind is the same way. It's just so clutter to say, okay, how do I piece it together? Where do I want to go? And there's this body of work I've been trying to do now for about three years, and I just can't. That's why I've done it a couple of times, but I really want to delve deep into it and I feel like the way I want to do it, it's going to take time.

00;21;17;04 - 00;21;31;24
Tommy Mitchell
And I'm really weird about time. Like, I'm like, Look, I want to be able to do it in three months. I want to do all the works I want to do for that in three months. And I feel like this is going to be a year thing. But if it's a gift from the curse, I should take the time out to do it.

00;21;32;01 - 00;21;51;25
Tommy Mitchell
But I also want to share other ideas as well. I feel like that would be like one of those comeback shows or whatever. What do I see? Jeff Koons at the Guggenheim? I don't know. One of those big shows. He just had all his work and like some new stuff, whatever. Like I want to do something like that.

00;21;51;25 - 00;22;07;09
Tommy Mitchell
But yeah, the ideas will never cease to exist. I'm always going to have an idea and I'm always going to want to share it. It's just a matter of, you know, sitting down, sitting still and executing it in and sharing it with the people.

00;22;08;12 - 00;22;23;22
Rob Lee
Execution and time is definitely that thing. I thought I was going to add that question in here. I didn't at it, but, you know, sitting around it, you know, it was that whole rumor about like artists, you guys don't deal with time well and all of this different.

00;22;23;22 - 00;22;25;01
Tommy Mitchell
Stuff a lot.

00;22;25;01 - 00;22;42;20
Rob Lee
Right. And I think it's a sort of variance. I think you have some folks who are hyper structured and you know, how to get stuff on point is like, look, I got 45 minutes for this interview, bro, and I got to get off it immediately. And then other folks that kind of float through and in there somewhere, it's a continuous somewhere in the middle.

00;22;43;12 - 00;23;02;27
Rob Lee
I when I'm approaching this, like I'd like to be able to do it. I, you know, I'll tell a guess like, look, we could do a half an hour, we can do 45, we can do an hour. And I'm already in my head. I'm looking at the max time I got to block out this time. Yeah, right. And that's the way I structured or even, you know, one of my aim in doing this.

00;23;03;05 - 00;23;19;11
Rob Lee
This is the thing I have one of my sort of crowning moments was being able to do like a hyper curated cause. I wanted to try it. I was curious to see if I could do it. And it took me almost three years to get to it. That's so. And you know, it's just booking guests and coming up with something.

00;23;19;11 - 00;23;36;07
Rob Lee
I did a month focused on jazz musicians and jazz folks and that scene. And I was able to put out like 12 interviews that month that had musicians and it was in different cities. And I was like, I got New Orleans, I got Philly, I got Baltimore, got D.C.. I was like, Yo, this is the thing. I was like, in it.

00;23;36;08 - 00;24;04;29
Rob Lee
It was that sort of as an Aquarius, it was that sort of actually, you know, it's like I made this, I made this happen and and actually appreciating to give myself credit for it because, you know, in doing this doing doing these interviews, doing these conversations, I'm aware what it is like. You know, I mentioned it a little bit earlier, but if how other people receive it, it's the thing that's interesting to me, oh, you're just doing this.

00;24;04;29 - 00;24;25;22
Rob Lee
And it's like, well, the Jazz seem to like it, you know, or you're really crushing it. It's like, That's cool, you know, and trying to figure out what it is. But me, it's just again that the conversation in a relationship with time at a point I did 300 plus interviews in a year with the day job, with all of the things that I have to do.

00;24;26;06 - 00;24;45;05
Rob Lee
One day I had six interviews with all of the other stuff that I had to do when we had 18 interviews. And it's like, I don't have the time issue and I don't have the time, but it's like my concept of time. I suppose this is different, but almost to the degree where I would almost do too much work, you know, I would almost too many things.

00;24;45;17 - 00;25;06;10
Rob Lee
So thinking of like a piece that comes to mind, how labor intensive, what are the hours, what it was, the, you know, the strokes, if you will, that go in through, you know, a piece like, you know, maybe something recent, maybe something that comes to mind specifically. But what does that look like for you? What how how, how times that risked the.

00;25;08;04 - 00;25;45;05
Tommy Mitchell
Right getting shots, working on pieces, I think to piggyback off, you know, multitasking and having a job and doing what you're passionate about. When I was working, I was working at Apple for three years, and that was kind of like a pivotal point for me because I was doing shows, I was getting more opportunities, etc.. So I'm trying to juggle a girlfriend at the time, a job, and my passion, my work, my craft.

00;25;46;09 - 00;26;12;03
Tommy Mitchell
So I would take work to work and people were like, You're going to work on that here? And I'm like, Yeah, like I, I don't want to be here. I want to be, you know, showing my workplaces. So for me, I looked at as every second I had that wasn't on the clock. I was working. And you get to 15 minute breaks, an hour breaks up 15 minutes.

00;26;12;03 - 00;26;33;07
Tommy Mitchell
Cool. I'm going to work on my thing. An hour for an hour, work on it. And then the next 15, I'd work on it again. And then afterwards I go to studio, work some more. But I was just so hungry and adamant on achieving my goals and exceeding them that I didn't care if I was at work working on my work because this is what supposed to do with my life.

00;26;33;24 - 00;27;03;01
Tommy Mitchell
I felt like my job was my secondary job. Like so when COVID hit and I don't quit Apple's business either, but we got paid to just be home. So I'm like, All right, this is cool. I'm going to the studio. So now I'm getting paid to be in the studio, right? I mean, when I saw these works get paid twice, so I looked at it was like, Apple's helping me.

00;27;03;07 - 00;27;28;17
Tommy Mitchell
They're pushing me to get into my craft full time. It's like, okay, well, what is your schedule look like? All right, I'm going to wake up early, you know, put all this hours in, etc.. But to answer the question, as far as the work, like I mentioned earlier, I'm impatient. I work pretty fast. I'm I know the world's going to hate me for saying that, but I just really love what I do.

00;27;28;17 - 00;27;54;03
Tommy Mitchell
So I spend long hours working. I might work from seven to, let's say, here's how I put it. If it's off, what's the word I'm looking for? If, if, if there's not a show coming up, I might work from like 7 to 5 because five is usually when I play basketball every day. But if there's a show coming up, I might work from six to midnight, 6 to 1 a.m..

00;27;54;25 - 00;28;23;14
Tommy Mitchell
I'll have breaks in there to eat. I'll still go to the gym, play basketball. I might take a nap in the studio, but I always look at it like I got to stretch my days out. Now I can put more work in and yeah, let's say of regular piece depending on the size, probably would take a week. And now that I feel like I'm more comfortable as a painter, the painting aspect is it's insane.

00;28;23;14 - 00;28;48;27
Tommy Mitchell
It's more it's easier for me than the drawing aspect. I feel like the drawing is still labor intensive, but I just learn from other artist. I'm like, I'm very observant. I'm very I'm not afraid to ask questions. I always reach out to like my favorite artists and thankfully they respond back. And hopefully that's because I'm asking the right questions.

00;28;48;27 - 00;29;18;04
Tommy Mitchell
But they were like, Oh, you know, I work I work for five, six, 7 hours a like, wow, that's not a lot. I'm and I'm just shocked. But that's not a not to them it's I'm thinking, wow, what you do is so amazing, you would think it takes more time. So I looked at it as, okay, if they're using for, let's say 4 hours, for example, and I'm using 12, I want to use 4 hours of work, 4 hours of learning, and then 4 hours of seeking more information or seeking.

00;29;18;04 - 00;29;37;01
Tommy Mitchell
How can I tie everything in? So I had like a game plan and which is really weird because I always tell women that I date, I'm not a planner, like I'm go with the flow guy. I'm not just on my back. I think I'm spontaneity all day. Just there's no structure. I wake up, I know what to be, I know what needs to be done.

00;29;37;01 - 00;30;11;13
Tommy Mitchell
I don't do it. But I've learned that I kind of am a planner. It's just in my own little way. I always think I'm a strategist. I'm always thinking of every possible outcome and how to get there, what could happen? How can I pivot it? But yeah, to answer the question, the time thing it I try not to take too long because that means the work that I put in all in all over these years, something's wrong.

00;30;12;02 - 00;30;33;02
Tommy Mitchell
They shoot thousands of hours a day. If I'm shooting it wrong, they event it's still a the matter but you got to take you've got to have the right approach and mechanics has got to be right that way once it comes game time, all those shots are going to feel comfortable with. It's going to go in. It's not every time, but a better percentage of the time.

00;30;33;02 - 00;30;58;00
Tommy Mitchell
So I say that to say if all the time that I spent making sure I'm perfecting my details, the I'm looking at pictures now just details and the shading and the shadows and so on and so forth. I feel comfortable doing that. If I'm taking too long on that, then I feel like I need to step away or I need to do something else because this probably isn't going to be the one that's going to be finished.

00;30;59;11 - 00;31;26;07
Rob Lee
What is in that? What is the most challenging thing or the part of your of your process that you dislike the most or the most challenging? And I ask that because you had me thinking you. No, I started thinking of a system. Right. And doing this, I would just go at it. My thing is like I throw effort at stuff and I look at the top as my funder and I'm like.

00;31;26;09 - 00;31;26;21
Tommy Mitchell
Right.

00;31;26;27 - 00;31;46;26
Rob Lee
Funds, this is my money. I don't really take lunch. I'm up super early. So I'm going to put in, you know, sort of the this is not the work part. This is the fun part where the worst part is coming up with questions to try to ask something that's meaningful. That's interesting. And I go with my questions four or five times the questions that I sent you when we originally scheduled this.

00;31;46;26 - 00;32;09;05
Rob Lee
I've changed those since most. And but in it, you know, I remember talking with with a dude I was on, I work in data and I in it and we were talking with this dude and I was just like, Yo, so I do X amount of podcasts and this was when it was super slow, probably pre-COVID, and he was like, How many hours are you putting in and what's the output?

00;32;09;19 - 00;32;26;28
Rob Lee
And I was like, I'm putting them probably because I was editing them at the time. So I have an editor now. So I was just like the idea about hour and a half research, the interviews, but hour. And then I'm doing an hour and a half, 2 hours editing and then I have to do the distribution, then the converted ba ba ba ba ba ba ba.

00;32;27;11 - 00;32;47;14
Rob Lee
And he's like, Yeah, what part of that can you offload? And that's what he went with. And now my process is so tight that I didn't bring in someone to I train people to let me have an assistant. I need to do this part. I need to do the questions. But the other things doesn't really teach quote unquote talent.

00;32;47;14 - 00;33;07;02
Rob Lee
To do that, I need to be an involved in this part. But the questions and the sort of back and forth through it, that is the most challenging part for me in doing this. I don't even care about when it goes out like I do to a degree that you want people to like your stuff, but does it really control that?

00;33;07;02 - 00;33;19;10
Rob Lee
But what I can control the sort of this portion of it, this side of it. So for you, you know, with all of my explanation for you, what is the part of your process that you like? I kind of skip that, but it's important.

00;33;19;21 - 00;33;41;23
Tommy Mitchell
That that's why I laugh when you when you said it, because I'm always thinking I'm my work. I'm 100% creative guy. Like, I want all the credit, like, oh, oh, I want to share this thing with nobody or whatever. But at the same time, I know to scale and to reach where I'm trying to go, I'm going to need help.

00;33;41;24 - 00;34;12;05
Tommy Mitchell
And in retail that was management, leadership, so on and so forth. And the thing that everyone gave me feedback on, no matter what job or what place I work, that was like, you do amazing work, you're great, but you need to learn how to delegate. And that is something that no matter what I do, I just don't. I want to do it and I feel more comfortable now on the last year or so.

00;34;13;01 - 00;34;37;09
Tommy Mitchell
But to answer the question, what could I do? It's it's little stuff. Like if I can have someone come in and melt the paper on the panel, maybe I think about this often document the process I the lead on the plane. I'm like, I work too fast to be documenting what I do. Like I'm too impatient, like I said to do the stuff to do.

00;34;37;09 - 00;35;06;04
Tommy Mitchell
Like I can't just be sitting here setting up my tripod and like, I feel bad about people who follow me because, like, look, all I wanna do is pose basketball because that's it. Like, I'm sorry, this is a michael Jordan fan account, but sometimes I, sometimes sometimes I draw as great a draw. But yeah, the documentation helping me mount the paper on the panels, cutting the paper out, stretching the paper.

00;35;06;18 - 00;35;31;07
Tommy Mitchell
Um, let me think. What else titles, pricing like you get into, it's, it's no different than anything someone's passionate about once the business aspect comes into play, it's like, well, it's not so fun anymore. But for me, I don't look at it that way. I just feel like I always think, How can I turn those weaknesses into strengths?

00;35;32;12 - 00;35;53;04
Tommy Mitchell
So it's how can I become back to square one or back to earlier? How can I become more efficient at that if I don't have anyone I don't want to pay for anyone to do so. How can I, you know, knock that out in an efficient manner? So I see how that to say. You know, those are the things that I wish, not even wish I should probably have someone do.

00;35;54;08 - 00;36;17;04
Tommy Mitchell
But I also like being hands on. I feel like it's more recent now that I feel like a real artist. I'm doing this, I'm doing that, and I feel I'm not just drawing it, putting it in a frame and then selling it so. So it's stuff like that that I just feel that maybe that's the thing I feel accomplished when I do those other things.

00;36;18;04 - 00;36;41;20
Tommy Mitchell
It's all for me a part of the experience on my end that I'm able to speak to once I do have shows. And you know, I had those conversations with people, but yeah, I laugh because that there's a lot of stuff. I'm like, you know, I probably don't have to do this. Like, I could be doing more. I do a lot of work now, but I can probably do even, you know.

00;36;42;06 - 00;37;03;22
Rob Lee
The efficiency part that you touched on. It makes a lot of sense and I'll use this. You may find it funny, you may not. I think you're right when it comes to sort of the the business, the things that don't feel like the this is adjacent to the creative or it's steamed broccoli. I know it's important, but it's not the first thing I gonna eat on the plate, you know what I mean?

00;37;05;10 - 00;37;27;07
Rob Lee
And that's that always gets me. And, you know, folks will say and to your point about, do I want to pay someone for this? You know, I like to be hands on and what I do as well. So, you know, I reached out to you. It wasn't I had some charity and but but in it and I am always appreciative when anyone wants to be on the pie.

00;37;27;07 - 00;37;45;01
Rob Lee
And the thing that turns into sort of a challenge sometimes is folks are more like dicks. I just call it what it is peop some people are dicks and they just won't show up and it's just like, hey, you know, as I said earlier, I'm with you. I put us there, I'm with you, I'm in. So when someone just goes, yeah, I'm like, Oh, okay, cool.

00;37;45;20 - 00;37;47;03
Rob Lee
Good luck. You know what I mean?

00;37;47;03 - 00;37;50;13
Tommy Mitchell
And right. You got it. You got it, Chief. You got to play.

00;37;51;03 - 00;37;57;18
Rob Lee
I got I got this out of to eat. You know, I got a piece place. I got to get these shots.

00;37;57;18 - 00;38;00;21
Tommy Mitchell
Out of my way. No, got to play. I flipped his head. You said.

00;38;01;18 - 00;38;18;29
Rob Lee
It. It is a thing of like I organize myself in such a way. And I was talking to my partner about this. I was telling I was like, Yo, I get up at like 550 in the morning, you'll run bang weights and then I start the day and I get all of my stuff done in the course of the day.

00;38;19;27 - 00;38;43;09
Rob Lee
But in it, there's costs that come with that where I'm not I'm not staying up late. I'm not so all of those sort of choices that I make, not even sacrifice choices that I make, are for the benefit of me chasing the thing that I'm chasing. So when someone is inserted in that, you know, let's say we don't interview, we're agreeing to do it at this time and we're agreeing to do it in this capacity.

00;38;43;09 - 00;38;57;12
Rob Lee
I understand communication. You know, hey, I got to do it. You know, I got to move it. Whatever. I get that the lack of communication with all of the structure that's put in place, I just don't come in with some bullshit like, yeah. So you work, you do that, right? You know.

00;38;58;05 - 00;39;07;06
Tommy Mitchell
That's all you does. All right? You really just be out here, right? Well, that's that's.

00;39;07;09 - 00;39;15;20
Rob Lee
And that's the thing. So when folks come to me and it's like, oh, well, you're not to next near bro, you're not doing your social media a certain way. I was like, it's me, right?

00;39;16;05 - 00;39;17;16
Tommy Mitchell
This is my journey, my band.

00;39;17;25 - 00;39;52;29
Rob Lee
The interview is the thing, the interviews, the important thing that's that's, you know, the core ties in it. And, you know, but I think and this is sort of where the next question is going, I think being able to have those moments that take you away, like part of my process of developing questions and trying to structure this, I'm always kind of like, we reference a few books earlier, I'm always diving into some sort of book to get into the psyche of have a better understanding of it and a better understanding of what am I curious about and what are they curious about?

00;39;52;29 - 00;40;15;24
Rob Lee
How did those two things come together or what would be the question that this art is? This guest has never been asked or hasn't been asked enough. Those are the things I'm shooting for it. And in that vein, within, you know, sort of your process, you've mentioned it a few different times. How important is basketball for you within your process of kind of, you know, breaking it up?

00;40;16;01 - 00;40;18;05
Rob Lee
How important is that inserted in there?

00;40;18;29 - 00;41;01;28
Tommy Mitchell
Are my comments earlier. I always feel like I'm an athlete first because that to me taught me everything I needed to know about life. Like my parents gave me the tools, the information structure, the wherewithal. They gave me everything my my family, my siblings did as well. But as far as like where I am today with my work and my core is just it's it's sport and like I mentioned earlier, just learning about teamwork, discipline, goal setting, work ethic, drive, communication, there's all these things that I take a from sport and have taken with me to the art world.

00;41;01;28 - 00;41;28;21
Tommy Mitchell
And I feel like that's where my success comes from. Just being able to have the repetition of mounting a paper on panel after being after having a month of drawing something, melting it, melting it wrong. And I just wasted all that time drawing something that was amazing. Now will never see the light of day because I wasn't really good at melting paper on panel.

00;41;28;21 - 00;41;56;24
Tommy Mitchell
It there's teamwork that goes back a delegation aspect. I need a team I, I need to work with people. I need to communicate what my ideas are because there's someone out there who is perfect, a perfect fit for what I'm trying to do. And I might be a perfect fit for where they're trying to go. So there's all these different variables that for me just make sense and utilizing sport in my craft.

00;41;58;10 - 00;42;24;08
Tommy Mitchell
But as far as basketball specifically, I mentioned Jordan earlier, but Jordan and Kobe, for me, just there's an analogy I have to with them, but I grew up in a time where I watched Jordan play and it just like every other child, admired the wizardry and the it just was so poetic how this man just moved on the basketball court.

00;42;24;09 - 00;42;49;00
Tommy Mitchell
It just was effortless. And the I can't speak enough high praise or high words about just watching him and how it inspired me not only in the basketball court, but in the studio. But the same with Kobe. Kobe, I felt like, here's my analogy for the two. Mike is the guy on the Hill that I feel like you don't have access to and never met the guy.

00;42;49;00 - 00;43;13;13
Tommy Mitchell
But just from the optics with Kobe, on the other hand, was more accessible, you ask the question, so I'll give the information you asked the wrong question. We'll see where that goes. But at least he was willing to be accessible and give up the game to the younger players, you know, coming up and share that information. And I thought that's what I want to be.

00;43;13;13 - 00;43;34;25
Tommy Mitchell
I want to be a vessel. I want to be someone that you can ask questions to because I didn't take the traditional I didn't go to school. I did every oddball job. I'm doing art shows where I'm competing with like a band next to me. I said once I become at a certain level, I'm not doing no art shows where I like.

00;43;36;00 - 00;43;45;13
Tommy Mitchell
I'm riding with those little bands under the bus, with the bands playing next to me. I'm up. You try to. Well, yeah, it's ballpoint pen. No, no, no, no. It's acrylic. It's not charcoal like. No.

00;43;45;18 - 00;43;47;01
Rob Lee
So I get all.

00;43;53;07 - 00;44;14;05
Tommy Mitchell
The fans, the questions, just basketball. His has shown me and taught me so much about myself. It's just like that. I mean, it's cliche as it sounds like that sanctuary is like, okay, I want to get away from art for a little bit and just tire myself out and just shoot 100 shots, run up and down the court.

00;44;15;24 - 00;44;32;28
Tommy Mitchell
I hope the guys who I play with will listen to this because everyone will. Well, you'll be yelling at us, blah. I'm like, Well, because you don't even know me that you know, I mean, and I you said it, but what?

00;44;32;28 - 00;45;01;21
Rob Lee
Although this is actually because I'm so in it, I've had this sort of contingent of like, you know, you know, you have consulting with people that on your podcast people, right. And, you know, people around. And I remember talking to multiple people around this time. This is like 20, 21, I guess last dance came out and of course you naturally like who are you closest to the weighted they're depicted in this documentary and unsolicited people.

00;45;01;21 - 00;45;17;03
Rob Lee
No question. Yeah, a lot of Jordan was like, What do you mean? It's like, Yeah, a lot of Jordan energy. I was like, So no, Pippen is not Jordan. You just tell people like, Nah, this is how. This is why you got to fail, so you should just do this, right? He's like, You're pretty competitive and your work is energy.

00;45;17;20 - 00;45;21;25
Rob Lee
And I was like, Oh no, that's crude. And I started watching it. I was like, You Guys might be right.

00;45;22;04 - 00;45;51;16
Tommy Mitchell
I'll accept it. Oh yeah, you got in. And that's the thing. Like, you got to be able to receive feedback and criticism, etc., because that's what makes us who we are. You know, like I'm, I'm a put myself out there. I'm, I'm obviously competitive, but I don't want to use the P where I'm kind of petty. Like people don't probably say like you're really petty, but it's not petty to like harm someone.

00;45;51;16 - 00;46;16;16
Tommy Mitchell
It's petty to hold onto this information to become better. I use it as fuel and that goes with art as well. And I always felt like I'm competing in art and they don't understand. I'm like, No, I'm competing because I want to level up. What do I need to do to level up? I go to these museum shows, institutions, whatever I'm competing with whomever from 1800, I'm competing with whomever from 2024.

00;46;16;17 - 00;46;35;21
Tommy Mitchell
Like because I want to get better. I don't stagnancy is not an option for me. Like I can't that's not in me. So the competition aspect is so I force myself to level up. I'm seeing what this person doing, I'm seeing what that person is doing. It's like, Oh, okay, let me try something out. Let me try something different.

00;46;36;12 - 00;47;04;26
Tommy Mitchell
If it doesn't work, it doesn't work. Least I made the effort to not just continue to do the same thing over and over. And that goes back to the earlier point with like having different shows is because I want to do a lot of stuff like I want see where else I can go while I'm here. But when you're, when you are who you are, like the comparisons to, to Jordan, to people either going to appreciate it or they're not.

00;47;05;25 - 00;47;31;12
Tommy Mitchell
I don't care. Like I'm doing a supposed to do. I'm doing what I love, I'm doing what I'm passionate about. I'm doing what makes my parents proud. Like that's all I care about and everything else is moot. Point can care less. That's a huge problem at that point. So yeah, I don't want to sound too boisterous about it, but that I'm comfortable in making what I make, doing what I do.

00;47;31;19 - 00;47;44;21
Tommy Mitchell
I'm still humble, I'm still trying to achieve. I'm always going to listen, I'm always going to be aware. But sometimes it it's very direct. And, you know, someone might not like that.

00;47;46;06 - 00;48;03;04
Rob Lee
Yeah. No, no, no. I mean, you know, we're we're on the same page. So picking up what you put now and, you know, and I'm I'm there like, you know, when I get sort of the natural, hey, it's only so many black guys, they can do a certain thing. So you guys are the same. It's like in it and.

00;48;03;15 - 00;48;05;21
Tommy Mitchell
That's their reference point. What I'm learning.

00;48;05;29 - 00;48;20;20
Rob Lee
I do the thing. I don't know if you're a movie guy. I do the thing where it's like it's like the scene from, I think John Wick and he's like, you work it. It's almost that vibe. And yeah, when I see like, you know, someone that's doing something that's like, you could do that but you didn't edit that episode.

00;48;20;21 - 00;48;33;24
Rob Lee
My G And it's like professional courtesy and I get it is not no not not for you as opposed to while I get a fair amount when someone's like, yeah, man, you want him to do the same thing. She, Oh, I do that with all that.

00;48;33;24 - 00;48;54;05
Tommy Mitchell
Can never, you could never. What are we talking about? Like, I'm sorry, I don't think about that all the time. Yeah, yeah. That's your thing over there. But it also had to. I'm glad you mentioned that because for me. Well, it looks like this person. It looks like that person. I want to use names because these names are like elite.

00;48;54;05 - 00;49;13;07
Tommy Mitchell
Elite, but I'm like, oh, that's just your reference point. I had to understand. That's your reference point. You might not have a broad skill of art knowledge. You have this particular artist or person as a reference point and you're that's your that's how you compare it. So I had to understand that it's like, Oh, no, I'm drawing inspiration from over here.

00;49;13;08 - 00;49;27;25
Tommy Mitchell
You're thinking it's from way over there. That's cool. It's a long it's a lot of alphabets between A and Z, so I understand it. But yeah, I do get a fit. Well, yeah, I still get offended.

00;49;27;25 - 00;49;31;20
Rob Lee
So, you know, like I said, you know, we're all the same petty wave is all good it.

00;49;31;23 - 00;49;35;11
Tommy Mitchell
Yeah and I think that's what pushes me to do other stuff too.

00;49;35;11 - 00;49;57;11
Rob Lee
Yeah. Like, you know I have, it's funny like I have enough conversations with curators and so on that kind of embolden me and I know that, you know, folks, people snipe at each other, right? But I've had enough conversations with curators, with folks that I think are at a level that's higher than their vantage point. They are seeing things more broadly, right?

00;49;58;15 - 00;50;26;14
Rob Lee
No, no, no. You get this. You understand what you're talking about, not just. Oh, no, bro. I had and before moving to like my last couple of questions I had at an award like ceremony were have where I was being honored with the biggest grant that given from this thing congrats. Thank you. And in funding a lot of last season's work and I had this person there who was an artist type tell me that oh yeah, you're not doing anything creative.

00;50;26;14 - 00;50;35;06
Rob Lee
Anyway, I had to pack all of my six foot for all I had to pack all of it in. I was like.

00;50;35;22 - 00;50;36;03
Tommy Mitchell
Right.

00;50;36;16 - 00;50;38;27
Rob Lee
Got a bunch of white people know about the accepting award that.

00;50;40;18 - 00;50;41;03
Tommy Mitchell
Was what you.

00;50;41;03 - 00;50;49;19
Rob Lee
Just said. Like, actually, I'm getting this money, right? That's arts related and it's like a cool bro. You're crushing it.

00;50;50;02 - 00;50;50;19
Tommy Mitchell
You got it.

00;50;51;03 - 00;50;52;15
Rob Lee
You're here to see me, though, you know what I mean?

00;50;52;24 - 00;50;53;05
Tommy Mitchell
Right.

00;50;53;19 - 00;51;14;06
Rob Lee
And that's the thing. And, you know, I talk about it in, you know, because I'm the then the journalist guy on the this from the that and and I don't I don't know if you have a version of this but based on oh for sure yeah I think we're on the same page in you know, it's always this sort of I'm not in audition mode, you know.

00;51;14;15 - 00;51;15;23
Tommy Mitchell
Like I'm doing it.

00;51;15;27 - 00;51;35;00
Rob Lee
My work is one I do myself. The intent is one. And, you know, that's sort of what it is. I'm not you know, I'm humble, I'm not really talking, you know, my shit all the time. But the reality of it is I do this, you know, folks, eventually they come to me when they choose someone else and they choose something that's kind of substandard.

00;51;35;18 - 00;51;38;03
Rob Lee
It's like, go ahead and get this scuffed version of what I do.

00;51;38;28 - 00;51;40;17
Tommy Mitchell
Right of the bus down. You mean, come on.

00;51;40;26 - 00;51;57;05
Rob Lee
Yeah, it is. It just doesn't work. And the thing that gets me is the credit, you know, like you said earlier, now I want the credit. I want the credit, too. And when folks try not to throw the credit out there, it's like, oh, okay, cool. Yeah, you're going to act like, you know, we're just helping each other out.

00;51;57;05 - 00;52;00;14
Rob Lee
No, no, no, no, no, no. I'm I'm professional at this.

00;52;01;10 - 00;52;29;16
Tommy Mitchell
You know, you mentioned, like, your story. I immediately thought of a close family member who when I was younger. Well, I want to say I was maybe a year into saying, hey, I'm going to pursue full time. So this is probably like 20, 29, 20. And they said, oh, you know, you still working on your little hobby? I'm like, Oh, I'm sorry.

00;52;29;16 - 00;52;29;29
Tommy Mitchell
Excuse me.

00;52;30;10 - 00;52;31;22
Rob Lee
Never clapped back taxes.

00;52;32;04 - 00;52;53;18
Tommy Mitchell
All right. Running backs are about, like, what? And that's part of me, how I describe the Petty's holding, holding on to that. It's not something I had to hold on to. I should have held on to. But I did because I wanted to prove, hey, just remember you saying that. Because once I achieve that, don't look at me crazy.

00;52;54;05 - 00;53;23;23
Tommy Mitchell
Look at me later. Drop out. It's like you said that. Yeah, I was looking for that support. It wasn't there. And that's also another thing too. Like I had to realize and that moment, it doesn't matter if they don't understand. As long as I understand, that's what matters. I need to be my biggest supporter, number one fan, etc. People need to see that some will piggyback and rather that the bandwagon, whatever.

00;53;24;17 - 00;53;51;25
Tommy Mitchell
But it's not cool. I'm still here to do my work and to follow my path and embark on this journey no matter if it's alone or with people. I'd rather do it with people. I'd rather have that sense of community. But at the same time, like there's a full I want to say Drew Brees said is problematic, but he said it gets lonely being great.

00;53;53;05 - 00;54;01;15
Tommy Mitchell
Like it just be you just be you. You have the vision. You want to execute it. You have like all these ideas. It'd be you.

00;54;01;24 - 00;54;05;10
Rob Lee
You got to be an evangelist for yourself, right?

00;54;05;18 - 00;54;07;00
Tommy Mitchell
Right.

00;54;07;00 - 00;54;22;14
Rob Lee
And you don't like ambition. We don't like people who have goals. We, we we rather see people on the struggle and on to come up. But when you get there or however they look at you getting there, remember the whole thing about the what is it, the overnight success? It's like I don't it's ten years.

00;54;22;14 - 00;54;24;27
Tommy Mitchell
Yeah it's right everyone.

00;54;24;27 - 00;54;31;19
Rob Lee
So they is all of that stuff and then it's just like you seem like you want it too much. What? What do you.

00;54;31;19 - 00;54;36;28
Tommy Mitchell
Say? Why? What? Get away from me. Why? Why are you even here? Who brought you around me? I don't need better.

00;54;37;11 - 00;54;41;02
Rob Lee
Like neither do we have someone checking names at the door. What are we doing right?

00;54;41;02 - 00;55;09;18
Tommy Mitchell
Like. Oh, whose manners is this? I'm confused. I'm confused. And that's the thing. It's like, why would someone I love or someone who knows me bring that energy around? Like this is already hard enough as this being in a creative space where it's there's no guarantees, you know, it could be gone tomorrow. Whatever you want to talk to me about.

00;55;10;12 - 00;55;11;17
Tommy Mitchell
No, get away from me.

00;55;12;10 - 00;55;37;00
Rob Lee
I've lost friends as a result of sort of me being on it. And I'm not even going on the Jordan wave at all. No, I'm doing my thing and just doing my thing and actually even make space for to do their thing because it's that unity thing and you just start seeing like weird little things creep out and I'm like, it goes to the point in I'll move to this final, final question.

00;55;37;00 - 00;55;49;28
Rob Lee
When I say this, it moves to this point of the Drew Brees thing. Like you said, you know, it's just I'm doing this. And all I can say is when I start popping up on billboards, that's when people had green eyes suddenly.

00;55;50;14 - 00;55;50;27
Tommy Mitchell
Right.

00;55;51;06 - 00;55;54;26
Rob Lee
It's very it's very, very weird to me.

00;55;55;26 - 00;56;35;19
Tommy Mitchell
Hometown heroes for me, the clips. I remember them referencing this early on, too. I remember them referencing they to go get hot elsewhere before they got hot in Virginia, which is like, you know, mind you, me as a as a as a viewer consumer of their product. Well, they're kind of products, but so being observant, you know, me being a, you know, a fan, you would think we would have that say so like, no, you were hot here.

00;56;36;01 - 00;57;07;08
Tommy Mitchell
But the person who's always in the trenches, they're going to tell, you know, we had to go to Philly, we had to go to in New York and get Grinded Pop in Detroit and get grind a pop. It's and it's it hurts and I'm not going to ever talk a crazy about my about Virginia but it's like you said I had to go elsewhere and do it to let you know, hey, I was serious and I always say, go where the best you can flourish.

00;57;07;25 - 00;57;27;05
Tommy Mitchell
If it's not home, you can't go somewhere else. Home will still be there. And if you have real support, the support will still be there. But if the best BSU is in Atlanta, go to Atlanta. The best view is in Boston. Go to Boston, go wherever you need to go. The floors, it's like they always tell you life is short, like go do it.

00;57;27;05 - 00;57;38;08
Tommy Mitchell
And if you fail, guess what? You still got that support system at home that's going to welcome you with open arms where it's okay. Let's start another game plan. Let's, let's, let's see what else we can do though.

00;57;38;08 - 00;57;56;10
Rob Lee
So those are bars right there and that that so so now that's really, really timely because it's definitely something that, you know, I've had a few conversations today in that vein, actually. So. All right, this is sort of the last this is almost a rapid fire question.

00;57;56;14 - 00;57;57;12
Tommy Mitchell
Yeah, let's do it. You know.

00;57;57;12 - 00;58;12;00
Rob Lee
Rapid fire questions. But, you know, so, so, so ballpoint pens. Let's let's talk about it like, you know, I'm I'm choosy. I'm looking at I got I always keep a little notepad with me. I write down my questions in there for inspiration. I don't always get that thing on me.

00;58;12;08 - 00;58;15;04
Tommy Mitchell
So yeah, don't keep I keep grabbing.

00;58;15;28 - 00;58;28;24
Rob Lee
Whatever you're doing, all right? You're crafting, you know, works or what have you. Do you have, like a favorite brand, a favorite type of pen? What stands out to you when you're, like, choosing sort of the instruments? And ultimately, how did Pen come along?

00;58;29;29 - 00;58;55;22
Tommy Mitchell
Oh, a favorite brand. I'm going to shout them out since we've done business together recently. A favorite brand is Bic and even if we didn't do business together, I've been using them since I started on this journey of just working with a pen, for that matter. I've used every different style. Bic Cristal. What? What is it? The stick.

00;58;55;22 - 00;59;19;12
Tommy Mitchell
Like. Like there's just all these different options that you have and I've tested over all of them. But how I got there, the very I think it's a funny story. So I'm in high school, I'm a senior in high school. And this goes back to the competitive aspect. I'm a senior and we're drawing something or another. And this freshman is sitting at a corner from me.

00;59;19;12 - 00;59;41;05
Tommy Mitchell
I remember how that conversation came up, but she said, My mother or my grandmother uses ballpoint pen. That way she don't make mistakes. So for me it was like, aha, always like, Oh, I got to use ballpoint pen, I want to make mistakes. So from that moment and 2000, I want to say 2000, one or 2001 to now.

00;59;41;05 - 01;00;06;05
Tommy Mitchell
So I guess that's about 23 years now. I've only not only, but I've used ballpoint pen as the main focus and it's, it's, I love the feedback that I received. And I think early on when I started doing shows, it's, oh, is that pencil, is that graphite? Like, what is that? I'm like, Oh, it's ballpoint pen. Oh wait, what the word and right.

01;00;06;08 - 01;00;43;29
Tommy Mitchell
It's like, excuse me part like. But also I also took it very serious because I don't see ballpoint pen or ink artist in museums and these institutions that we frequent. So that was there's a lot of goals and checkmarks that I have mentally that over time I look to you know, check off and achieve. But the the ballpoint pen thing it just it you know I mentioned earlier I was framing my work and when people would see it, they were all okay, it's cool.

01;00;44;11 - 01;01;04;21
Tommy Mitchell
They're like, oh, it's ballpoint pen. Wait, wait, what? And there was that glass barrier, that plexi barrier. So when I learn how to mount paper on panel, it took that barrier away and people could really get up close with the the piece and get real intimate with it and be like, Oh, wow, wait, I'm sorry. You said, no, this is really ballpoint pen.

01;01;04;21 - 01;01;23;06
Tommy Mitchell
It's like you're in back then. It used to be that used to be the great feeling. But now that I'm older, wiser, smarter, or whatever have you, I want it to be a great piece of work first and if they find out it's ballpoint pen on the back end, cool. Like at the end of the day, I still want the piece to be, you know what it is?

01;01;23;06 - 01;01;27;12
Tommy Mitchell
I want to execute that vision and and share that with the people and have them build.

01;01;27;12 - 01;01;43;02
Rob Lee
Rapport with it. Thank you, sir. So that's kind of it for the real podcast. And so now I got got to hit you at these rapid fire questions and definitely, as I tell everyone, to not overthink it.

01;01;43;02 - 01;01;54;08
Tommy Mitchell
Yeah. All right. So an over LeBron, Nike, over Adidas, what else? Okay. All right, all right.

01;01;54;16 - 01;01;57;18
Rob Lee
All right, all right. So the first one is basketball related.

01;01;58;10 - 01;01;59;17
Tommy Mitchell
Okay.

01;01;59;17 - 01;02;10;23
Rob Lee
Who who is your favorite? It was going to be player, but I've changed it. Who is your favorite? Okay. Who was your favorite team currently and what was your favorite team? Growing up was.

01;02;10;24 - 01;02;24;15
Tommy Mitchell
Tricky. It was a strategy growing up. It was Phenix nice. Definitely Phenix my. So this goes like I, I root for teams because of their logo. I love their design.

01;02;25;01 - 01;02;25;20
Rob Lee
As you should as.

01;02;25;21 - 01;02;50;09
Tommy Mitchell
Well, which is crazy. Like the Raiders. I root for the Raiders because I saw it when I was growing up. Every hip hop video, NWA, growth, just every rap video had Raider had Raider Jack or whatever. But the thumbs. My dad would always have to see why he's an Air Force. He would go to Phenix, to the base out there, and he'd always bring me like a t shirt or something back.

01;02;50;28 - 01;03;17;14
Tommy Mitchell
So I just kept wearing them like, I guess I'm a Suns fan. Nebraska Cornhuskers, same thing, but it was Phenix and then I jumped off the bandwagon after they got rid of Nash. But I've always been a player's guy, root for players and if you really notice the NBA since really Jordan came along, not even Jordan Magic and Bird has been about the player magic versus Bird Jordan versus it's always about the player.

01;03;18;05 - 01;03;49;22
Tommy Mitchell
So now I've always loved Steph Curry and Klay Thompson, like even prior to the whole explosion. I just have been a fan of just this guy who's really changed the game. Yeah, it's just unexplainable. But now I root for Golden State. Every now and then I still root for Phenix, but I just really root for players I like seeing.

01;03;50;04 - 01;04;09;16
Tommy Mitchell
I'm a two way guy, so the guy, the guy's a defender and you know, he plays both sides of the ball. I'm root for that guy. Yeah, because I can't. I'm not big on just guys who are out there to score a million points and then just giving up No. 199 BO On the other end so hard. So hey, you said it.

01;04;09;16 - 01;04;35;21
Tommy Mitchell
You said it. Not that he's cool and he's changed the game in a way as well. It's just I can't I don't want to say I don't respect it. It's just not how I enjoy basketball. I like the guy like, look, and I guess it goes back to the Michael Jordan thing more so cool because I think Pippen guarded more the greater guys, but whoever the best player on the court side of the court is, I'm going, that guy, I'm gonna put up 45 and make sure your average is 30.

01;04;35;21 - 01;04;59;09
Tommy Mitchell
Cool. We will knock that down about 17 and 18, 19, 20, whatever. So that's what I appreciate is like that goes back to the competitive nature. It's like I like those type of players like, yo, I got this guy, I'm like now, so, so yeah, that's Phenix back then. Kind of Phenix now. Golden State every now and then, but mainly players now.

01;05;00;16 - 01;05;03;28
Rob Lee
Okay, so it's just for talking ball. I got to throw my eyes out there.

01;05;03;28 - 01;05;05;25
Tommy Mitchell
I guess I could talk ball forever.

01;05;06;15 - 01;05;17;19
Rob Lee
Similar thing because I'm I'm I think me you're about the same age and the same age group and obviously my parents, we, you know, Baltimore, we have a basketball team, you know.

01;05;17;23 - 01;05;23;07
Tommy Mitchell
Right. Oh, all the Wizards. I mean, the bullets that we get a lot of bullets, games of the Q or.

01;05;23;16 - 01;05;24;00
Rob Lee
A but.

01;05;24;27 - 01;05;37;02
Tommy Mitchell
No bullets no caliber Cheney Chris Webber and George Mason roster include John Howard's XI Chapel Hill Chapel Hill be do that say that everybody will be up hill.

01;05;37;08 - 01;05;38;08
Rob Lee
Tracy Martin for the three.

01;05;40;07 - 01;05;41;09
Tommy Mitchell
C call.

01;05;42;06 - 01;05;51;14
Rob Lee
My one of my teachers in and high in middle school he was Sam Cosell's uncle so I would always yeah yeah that's the Baltimore but anyway right.

01;05;52;23 - 01;05;54;21
Tommy Mitchell
It would be good that Baltimore when they hear this.

01;05;55;11 - 01;06;14;03
Rob Lee
It would be we always would get like merch and stuff. So whatever the teams that were winning my but we were like pretty much strictly a bowls house like throughout the nineties and then like at the 2000 just like and we're here for the Lakers I was always sort of the sideline Spurs guy. I was always a Spurs guy.

01;06;14;12 - 01;06;14;29
Rob Lee
Spurs and.

01;06;15;08 - 01;06;31;08
Tommy Mitchell
Basketball. Yeah. We okay. Well, it's only really two different version. Alonzo Okay. Yeah. Alonzo Yeah. Damn. Marley Thunder. Dean Tim Hardaway. Rodney Finally, I'm with him. I'm with, you know.

01;06;32;17 - 01;06;45;09
Rob Lee
You know, just having that vibe of like, oh, I'm going to do this East Coast team, but I'm like, because Tim, Doug is my favorite player. So it's just like, I know that's direction, you know, fundamentals are untouched.

01;06;46;03 - 01;06;49;12
Tommy Mitchell
Untouched, you can't not lose would be what the basics look come to.

01;06;49;12 - 01;06;50;25
Rob Lee
Get some MVP is off of this.

01;06;51;12 - 01;07;00;21
Tommy Mitchell
List they all they talk about it's like who had a better career Kobe or Tim Duncan. It's like you guys are the way you can go either way.

01;07;01;12 - 01;07;18;09
Rob Lee
Yes. So this this is like this is like one. So, you know, I definitely this is a this is a Baltimore centric podcast. You know, we have you know, we stretch outside of Baltimore. But is Baltimore is the home where do you spend most of your time in Baltimore or any places that you're like.

01;07;18;20 - 01;07;49;12
Tommy Mitchell
Oh, I'm a hermit. I'd be at the studio work in. But as far as I'm trying to be, who I want to give publicity to, this is other than the gym. Other than the gym. That's a good question. What do I be? I like to. So here's my running joke been my friends have given me. I'll be outside, but I don't be outside.

01;07;50;19 - 01;07;57;12
Tommy Mitchell
Like I like all the cool, nice restaurants like I've been there, but no one ever. I like.

01;07;58;04 - 01;07;58;16
Rob Lee
Yeah.

01;07;59;29 - 01;08;03;03
Tommy Mitchell
Dang. Oh yeah. That's it.

01;08;03;03 - 01;08;20;25
Rob Lee
See now but, but I think you did though. But I think you got it though because you know, I used to be out there pretty regularly, right? Got drinks in different places. I got a signature drink on menus, got coffees. Right. And I was like, I need to be a reckless, reckless. Now. I can't be out here anymore.

01;08;20;25 - 01;08;36;00
Rob Lee
It's just like, look, I'm very noticeable. I've had my girl reminded me that I'll be down like that. Nobody cares. And she was just like, Yo, a dude, stop in like traffic and say, Yo, Rob knows. Just like, literally. So it's just.

01;08;36;00 - 01;08;36;26
Tommy Mitchell
Like, I keep it out.

01;08;37;18 - 01;08;41;10
Rob Lee
Of it. It's like both of his lay out. I'm like, I'm 64, so I can't really.

01;08;41;10 - 01;08;42;07
Tommy Mitchell
Hi there.

01;08;42;07 - 01;09;02;11
Rob Lee
Yeah, they're just like, put him in the post, literally like, yo, boxer and is literally that. But yeah, it's it's like some of those places I go to, you know, sometimes folks will invite me, you know, I have friends that are chefs and things like that, but I spend most of my time in an arts district. You might be stationed north or something like that.

01;09;02;27 - 01;09;16;01
Rob Lee
And I go, Where to get coffee is that? I go where the folks are at, but really my thing is to your to your point, like the studios in the crib, you know, I can write bedrooms to a studio. That's just what it is. I need to go.

01;09;16;05 - 01;09;17;07
Tommy Mitchell
Work on it. But they're paying in.

01;09;17;25 - 01;09;18;15
Rob Lee
100%.

01;09;18;15 - 01;09;34;25
Tommy Mitchell
And I want to save money. What? I want to save money. I'm I want the money aspect doesn't really matter, but it's like I'd rather be the gym I'd rather be in the studio like, like I said I'd be out, but it's like now I'll wrap this up. I want to get the some shots up. I want to get some pieces done.

01;09;35;08 - 01;09;59;11
Tommy Mitchell
You choose like so. And I always say to for me to scale even further, I need to be outside and campaign, kiss babies, shake hands to let people know I exist, which is fine. I feel like I do a great job of that via socials, but when people meet me, I think that's a completely different, completely different thing.

01;09;59;11 - 01;10;22;28
Tommy Mitchell
I feel like I'm very personable, very animated, especially when you talk sports are just anything I'm passionate about, as I'm sure anyone is. But yeah, I'd rather spend my time getting better that way in time. You know, I can open a business that I would want to spend time at or whatever and then put my work in there.

01;10;22;28 - 01;10;35;12
Tommy Mitchell
But yeah, I'm. What do they say? Keep the main thing. The main thing. Like, I like being out with my friends, whatever, but I'd rather be putting their pain in in the studio and just getting the work done.

01;10;36;00 - 01;10;40;06
Rob Lee
I can't wait for that. Robin and Tommy Mitchell podcast on State.

01;10;40;06 - 01;10;50;12
Tommy Mitchell
Of the Art. Hey, look, you let me know I used to be a station or my studio is the station is right there next to go brewery will go by anytime.

01;10;50;12 - 01;10;51;22
Rob Lee
You chop it up my g.

01;10;52;04 - 01;10;53;07
Tommy Mitchell
Definitely.

01;10;53;07 - 01;11;11;28
Rob Lee
So I got one last one for you and it goes a little something like this. You know, it doesn't have to be good. I mean, it has to be good. Doesn't I have to be healthy? What did your, like, go to like like me. I have an African buddy. Oh, I have an African buddy who's really funny. He's like, he's a dog.

01;11;12;07 - 01;11;14;08
Rob Lee
You Just like, yeah, I'm trying to be nasty this weekend.

01;11;14;09 - 01;11;17;17
Tommy Mitchell
I'm like, you're like.

01;11;18;02 - 01;11;19;21
Rob Lee
You mean by that, bro?

01;11;20;26 - 01;11;26;07
Tommy Mitchell
Oh, my you got to be more specific, sir. He's talking crazy right now. All right, look at a.

01;11;26;07 - 01;11;27;08
Rob Lee
Mirror of my G.

01;11;28;02 - 01;11;40;22
Tommy Mitchell
They were. Oh, man. What? Let me think. I look breakfast food like I think he breakfast food all day long good. But what's he said what's a meal that.

01;11;41;21 - 01;11;56;12
Rob Lee
It's like this is, you know, people say comfort meal, for lack of a better term. I say, what is the vein or what have you like when I when I when I think about something I'm really looking for and I'm kind of snobbish about it for me, always. New Orleans food so.

01;11;56;29 - 01;11;57;13
Tommy Mitchell
Cost.

01;11;58;16 - 01;12;00;11
Rob Lee
And birthdays. A couple of weeks ago, I made.

01;12;00;12 - 01;12;01;10
Tommy Mitchell
One happy belated.

01;12;01;18 - 01;12;17;10
Rob Lee
Thank you. May one request. I was talking to my girl. I was like, yeah, and you make me some ribs and rice and oh, absolute Lee. And she knows because I'm a snob. She's like, Yeah, then Dewey Sausage, I was like, Thank you. Because if you put them on, I'm not going to eat it.

01;12;18;05 - 01;12;23;01
Tommy Mitchell
Right. You can keep it, though, to hold this away. Like, what are we doing? You cook that? No, put that in the trash. No, I don't want that.

01;12;23;01 - 01;12;24;08
Rob Lee
Why would you spend time on that?

01;12;24;17 - 01;12;28;27
Tommy Mitchell
Right. Make that one won't the trash can you.

01;12;28;27 - 01;12;49;14
Rob Lee
What have you been. You know, I had you know, I went to the sushi spot in D.C. the day before, you know, Love Makoto, really dope, had a great experience. And then I had the the homemade seed, you know, the red beans and rice. You know, it's a religion. You know, we out here and I'm a little bit that way, you know, stripping grits to you know, it's the same vibes as like it has to be done a certain way.

01;12;49;14 - 01;12;53;01
Rob Lee
It's like if you're not going to do it the way it needs to be done, then don't do it right.

01;12;53;01 - 01;13;32;09
Tommy Mitchell
Don't. Yeah. And yeah. So it depends I guess it depends on it depends on where I'm at. It depends on I guess it really depends on where I'm at. Like I don't I've really toned down on red meat a lot over past probably ten years. I always say I do the vegan thing like maybe 5 to 7 days a week, but there's certain things I just can't like you said, shrimp and grits.

01;13;34;01 - 01;13;57;01
Tommy Mitchell
I haven't had good SFA and I don't know how long. Yeah, like there's a certain things on my when I'm, when I'm out like I'm out here in L.A. I notice certain things I'm going to have to have while I'm out here. But if there's one thing, gosh, I don't want to hold it, but I oh, okay. There we go.

01;13;57;22 - 01;14;00;11
Tommy Mitchell
I like this Korean dish. Bibimbap.

01;14;00;24 - 01;14;02;02
Rob Lee
Oh, yeah.

01;14;02;11 - 01;14;27;22
Tommy Mitchell
A lot like, a lot, a lot, a lot. So I'm from I'm sure you're familiar with the spot Columbia called Baby BOP. Yeah, that's like I drive out there. I'm I'm I'm about to talk crazy now. I drive out there. I'll get to two bowls, I'll eat one there by the time I get back home because, you know, it's about 25, 30 minutes to get back to Baltimore.

01;14;27;22 - 01;14;50;06
Tommy Mitchell
Soon as I get back home, my guess and I'm probably gassing it up, but it's just that good. But there's a new spot. Maybe I should put that. Maybe should give them some love. Monkey Charm City, Charm City Pokéballs or something. It's right there at Harbor East and I walk over there and I get the same baby bought dish, bibimbap dish every time.

01;14;50;06 - 01;15;11;28
Tommy Mitchell
That's like, yeah, that's one of those things. Matter of fact, that's what I'm getting while I'm out here. But that's one of those things I really, I just, I, and that's how, you know, I enjoy I can't even put into words how much I enjoy it. But that that's probably that's why I did this and I love eggs so both sunny side up egg on anything and I'll I'll come run it.

01;15;12;21 - 01;15;30;24
Rob Lee
It's a great response it's a great answer and that's kind of it. You have the hot seat. So, you know, one, I want to thank you so much for coming on. It's been truly and of course and too, I want to invite and encourage you to share with the listeners where they can check you out, socials, the website, all of that good stuff.

01;15;30;24 - 01;15;32;03
Rob Lee
The floor is yours.

01;15;32;27 - 01;16;00;14
Tommy Mitchell
Definitely. Thank you. One again. Appreciative for you having me. I'm sorry for being so long winded and passionate when it comes to sports. As far as where they can reach me, you can go to my website. Tommy Mitchell and the L's are one so. Tom And why my P.S. 81 Wine.com same across the social feel. And then why am I TCHC one one and you can find me in the National Portrait Gallery.

01;16;00;14 - 01;16;00;24
Tommy Mitchell
One there.

01;16;01;22 - 01;16;24;05
Rob Lee
There you have it, folks. I want to again thank Tommy Mitchell for coming on and chatting with us on this podcast and sharing a bit of his story and his journey. And I'm Rob Lee, saying that there's art, culture and community in and around your neck of the woods. You've just got to look for it.